Earlier this week, I attended a talk about Islam and homosexuality at a medical school in Karachi. The very fact that medical practitioners, particularly psychiatrists, were gathering to discuss the subject piqued my interest. After all, a variety of psychological and physical ailments have been documented in patients who suppress or conceal their sexual identities in conservative societies.
But I was disappointed to learn that the lecturer was taking a historical perspective and simply tracing the history of homosexuality in Muslim societies. It would have been far more interesting to hear a debate about the prevalence of homosexuality in contemporary Muslim societies and consider ways in which psychiatrists and GPs respond to patients who are gay, and whether approaches differ if patients embrace their sexual identity or consider it an affliction.
Still, it was encouraging to see some acknowledgement within our local medical community that homosexuality is a phenomenon worth keeping in mind when dealing with patients (and what better place to start than at the very beginning). For readers who are now expecting a grand theological debate about whether homosexuality is permitted in Islam, feel free to click elsewhere on this website. That question is still up for debate, with some Muslim groups condemning homosexual acts as a sin and others arguing that it is natural, and therefore created and condoned by the Almighty. This post simply considers how Muslim societies deal with homosexuality in practice.
The fact that Muslim societies are struggling to figure out how to respond to homosexuals in their midst is perfectly illustrated by Iran. A few years ago, the country enraged human rights groups and made headlines when it publicly hung two young men – one 18, the other a minor – for being gay. Soon after, President Mahmoud Ahmedinejad further irked the global community by flat-out denying that there were any homosexuals in Iran. How then, the world asked, can you hang young men for something doesn’t exist and thus couldn’t have happened? Ahmedinejad’s – and Iran’s – confusion about what to do with homosexuals is widespread in the ummah – should Muslim societies seek out and punish homosexuals? Ignore their very existence? Or acknowledge that they live and – gasp! – worship in Muslim societies and therefore protect their human and constitutional rights?
To help address some of these questions, the lecturer went back in time to the Ottoman and Abbasid empires, during which homosexuality was commonly practiced and socially tolerated, though not explicitly legally protected. Back then, the lecturer explained, there were various reasons for homosexual behaviour (including lesbianism) being widespread.
Firstly, the legal system was multifaceted and did not take a decisive stand on homosexuality. Cases were judged either by the sultan’s law, common law or shariah, of which only the last had an opinion about homosexuality. Homosexuals were rarely taken to court on account of their homosexuality – if they did end up before a judge or qazi, it was for another social transgression (such as disturbing the peace). According to the lecturer, and here I summarise, the thinking at the time was that people’s sexuality was no one’s business unless they made a nuisance of themselves. Qazis who did pass judgement on homosexuals usually did not punish them for their sexuality per se, but for their conduct with regards to social norms (so, if someone abducted a young boy or committed a sexual act near a school, they would be punished for kidnapping or indecency and not for homosexuality).
Legal crackdowns on homosexuals during various Islamic empires were also few and far between because the burden of proof on the accuser was immense. As Brian Whitaker sums it up for The Guardian:
Furthermore, the levels of proof required by Islamic law are so high that if the rules are properly applied no one need ever be convicted unless they do something extremely blatant, like having sex in the street in broad daylight.
The lecturer also explained that if a person accused someone else of homosexuality and was not able to muster up the required evidence or witnesses, they would be permanently discredited and prohibited from testifying before any shariah court again.
In addition to legal laxity, homosexuality was prevalent in the Islamic empires because the cultures prescribed to a ‘one sex model’ in which conceptions of beauty were the same for men and women. The lecturer showed several miniature paintings from the Abbasid era in which men and women were indistinguishable (check out this famous illustration of Shah Abbas with a wine boy). Men would wear make up and drape themselves in gowns and jewels while women with downy mustaches were considered the most attractive (apparently, women would paint on mustaches to seem more comely!) Youth – rather than femininity or masculinity – was idealised, thereby eliminating the taboo around homosexual relationships.
Given the permissive attitudes of previous Muslim societies, how then did we get to a point where minors can be hung for being gay? The lecturer argued (convincingly, I might add) that present-day homophobia in Muslim societies is a fallout of the colonial encounter. Her logic relied on several premises.
Firstly, Europe subscribed to the ‘two sex model’ in which women were feminine and desired by men. Secondly, at the end of the eighteenth century, Europe, which was at the tail end of the Enlightenment, had reconfigured homosexuality from being a ‘sin’ into an ‘abnormality.’ When Catholicism was dominant, homosexuals were sinning against God, and could thus be managed (all that was needed was for them to confess their sin and atone by saying a few Hail Marys). As rationalism and science replaced God, homosexuality became a medical disorder, which was more threatening and harder to ‘cure’. Therefore, when ascendant European powers began to infiltrate the Muslim empires, homosexuality in the West was considered abnormal and inappropriate.
Now, as Muslims began traveling to Europe – which by this point was more progressive and wealthy than the Ottoman and Persian empires, and in some cases beginning to colonise the eastern powers – they saw that homosexual practices that were common and acceptable in their societies were considered abnormal in the West. They also began to wonder whether this ‘abnormal’ behaviour was not the cause of their weakness in the face of European colonialists. It was these initial encounters that began to taint the practice of homosexuality in Muslim societies.
And the rest, as they say, is history. With references to present-day Muslim societies and their attitudes towards homosexuality, Whitaker writes:
Nevertheless, while attitudes towards homosexuality in the west over the last few decades have generally been liberalising, Muslim countries have been moving in the opposite direction. This is largely a result of international politics. Perceptions of a domineering west, coupled with fears of globalisation and modernity have brought a revival of imagined “customs and traditions”, along with the spread of rigid and puritanical versions of religion.
The phenomenon he describes, however, is not that recent. According to the lecturer, as Muslim empires were colonised, they laid claim to the one thing that their colonial masters had not tainted and could not influence – Islam. And this they began to cling to in its most extreme and literal version. Since the mid-nineteenth century, then, Muslim societies have been largely anti-gay. Shariah courts that would previously disregard homosexual acts came to punish them harshly.
Or that, at least is the perception. Hearing the lecturer speak about the attitude towards homosexuals in the Ottoman and Abbasid empires, I couldn’t help but see parallels with modern-day Pakistan. Admittedly, there are no openly gay men in our society (and if there are, they suffer the consequences of social isolation, professional discrimination, and in many cases, arranged marriages which result in psychological trauma both for the man and the unfortunate woman he marries).
At the same time, though, we have Begum Nawazish Ali on our airwaves, hijras on every street corner, young ‘maalish walas’ at every roundabout, Dostana in our cinemas, innumerable curse words for homosexual men in our vernacular, and foppish characters in every comic skit. As Irfan Husain puts it:
This aspect of human sexuality is rampant in our part of the world, much as we would like to sweep it under the carpet….
Despite our prudish pretence, the fact is that we are relatively tolerant of homosexual behaviour. Our literature contains many references to romantic attachment between men. And for years, homosexuality in Pashtun society has been an open secret, although it might well be exaggerated. According to local tradition, many men live by the credo “Women for duty; boys for pleasure.”
While social mores condemn homosexuality and Pakistan’s didactic middle-class says ‘tauba tauba’ at the very thought of same-sex relations, we are thankfully not at the stage where there are witch-hunts for homosexuals. It seems as if the historic Muslim attitude towards gay men applies here too – out of sight, out of mind. As long as homosexuals don’t fly rainbow flags from atop the Teen Talwar, we don’t mind if they’re in our midst.
Indeed, as long as homosexuals are willing to preserve the façade of a heterosexual social order in which men and women get married and have babies, they probably have little to fear (at least in terms of prosecution and state punishment – society’s righteousness is another matter altogether). What this status quo denies them, though, is the option of ever celebrating their sexual identity. Gay pride is something I do not see on the horizon for homosexuals in Pakistan. But in an age where regard for human rights should trump all, they deserve better than that. One can only hope that the current era of don’t-ask-don’t-tell tolerance evolves into something more progressive and open. Sadly, looking at present-day Pakistan as it abandons social tolerance for blind extremism, it seems as if history truly is fated to repeat itself.
Huma Yusuf is the features editor of Dawn.com.
The views expressed by this blogger and in the following reader comments do not necessarily reflect the views of the Dawn Media Group.
Surprise to see a bold step of writing on homosexuality.
Considering the Pakistani environment, I don’t find any space for homosexuality and neither any expected rights for them.
I don’t have exact reference of its prohibition in ISLAM but its one of worst things answerable.
Ive always wondered why has Islam got to be the deciding factor. Why cant those who want Islam in their lives live according to the teachings and ways of Islam and people who dont should be free to live as they wish as long as theyre not hurting anyone.
I think us Muslims have the least amount of faith in God, if we did we would leave all judgement up to Him.
huma, could you give us the name of the lecturer? I’m intrigued by her presentation and would like to know more about her work.
The problem with having religion define your identity is that a lot of times people end up not defining their identity on their own. You have a responsibility to yourself and the people around you to process the information through your filter, and through who you are, and your personal experiences. And develop your own identity in the process.
A lot of times religion steps in tell you who you are, and gives you a ready-made set identity. It’s just handed you like a package. Then it becomes who you are, and how you feel. Religion for most people can become, sort of, a hand book. It stops people to really think about issues, analyze their own lives, and what has happened to them. It inhibits them to logically work through their problems, and doing what’s best for their interest. Ironically, religion can help people become better people; it can also make them the worst people because it takes away their ability to be objective. I mean, you can’t look at a situation with honesty while running it through matrix that you didn’t even come up with. If you didn’t do the research on your own, you really have no power to claim who you are.
My identity when I was younger was largely based on religion, because my grandparents were religious. They told me everything that I was supposed to think, and “God” told them everything they were supposed to think. By the end of it none of us really knew what we were doing, simply because we weren’t taking the time to decide for ourselves. It’s still that way when I try to talk to them. It’s like I’m not talking to them; it’s like I’m talking to the latest religious eloign – which told them how to live their lives. They simply don’t do it own their own; we don’t do it on our own, and because of all this we live with a lot of unnecessary guilt and restraint.
When your identity is completely caught-up in this intense system of rules and regulations, you can’t relate to other people. You don’t give them a fair chance; or yourself a fair chance to express who you are. As right as self-actualization sounds, I think we all have to do some soul searching and decide who we are without a guidebook for ourselves and the people that we love.
I came out almost which three years ago in high-school, after years of denial I was finally taking time to figure things out on my own terms. I was practically out to the entire school – and no one ever called me names, and it turned out that my parents still loved me – it maybe due to the fact that went to school with extremely liberal rich kids, but it helped me realize that Pakistani people are willing to accept the change if you don’t rub it on their faces. I’m very open about my sexuality, but I never considered it my defining feature so I don’t make a big deal of it. Not all gay men fit the appalling stereotype from TV; we’re not all hairdressers or interior designers and I for one have never flounced or minced anywhere in my life!
When my parents told me to come home for summers this year, I was a little apprehensive. My friends were not home yet, and I had been away for a year myself. This meant meeting new people, and that scared me a little in the beginning. I started interning at an advertising agency. And the people I was working with were really cool about me being gay, and my relationship status. I guess things are really looking bright for the gay population in Pakistan.
In the end, I don’t think we need “Gay Pride.” There is nothing to be proud of if you happen to be gay. Are straight people proud of being straight? As weird as this will sound, here it is: I’m not proud of being gay, having said that, I’m not ashamed of it either.
How about our close relatives, the monkeys in the deep forests?
Are dominant male primates, with a large harem of available females, ever in their lives homosexual? If so, which stage of their lives?
How about non-dominant, outcast male primates – without ready access to females to meet their male (sexual) needs – Are they observed to indulge in homosexuality?
I humbly ask because i do not know.
Any nature/life science persons to kindly share FACTS on homosexuality in these societies?
Thanks
Good going huma,”Gay pride is something I do not see on the horizon for homosexuals in Pakistan. But in an age where regard for human rights should trump all, they deserve better than that”.
you are very right huma saying so but i hope our next generations might have this freedom to live their lives n dreams and am sure they will have this freedom of having a pride even coz we dnt have a strong movement yet,
so many people amongst us are such who have ruined their lives they were well awared of their sexual orientations but they got married under certain pressures n norms n then divorced,destroying 3 generations,
neways am pretty hopeful to get my rights one day to live freely in this country.
The discussion of sexual orientation in Pakistan society is not of significant to the immediate betterment of the society. It is an issue that may be addressed later in the social evolution of the society. The journalists in Pakistan should devout their energies in discussing how to increase supply of electricity, drinking water, food, mullahism, population growth.
Pakistan politician and other thinking people should deal with immediate problems and not sexual orientation, Musharraf trial at the behest of Nawaz Sharif at this point in time. Muslims societies should do thinking and reasoning in the context of time. It case of Pakistan all energies should be focus to discuss increase in the necessities of life. Intellectual discussion that does not create wealth in Pakistan is worthless. Sexuality discussion is not one of them. Quran is 1500 years old and no human being could foresee evolution of social order 1500 years hence.
Sexual orientation is irrelevant because with hunger, thirst, people will not have energy for heterosexual or other wise practices.
Muslims societies bearing the fundamental principle of Islam should do thinking and not look to Quran to solve all the problems faced by the societies today.
In Pakistan society people talk a lot and do little as such it is in a mess. in pre Musharraf days the talk was of getting BB, Nawaz Sharif back in the country. Now the talk is about the fate of Musharraf. Waste of human intellectual in discussing futile issues without increase of productivity.
Larry Stout Says:
“Perversion and evil don’t depend on philosophies or mythologies, though they may pretend to.”
Sorry to say the philosophies or mythologies have and still do provide dependence for perversion and evil. The upholding of cast system in Hindu Mythology, condoning of slavery in Semitic religions, invasion of sovereign nations to impose capitalist philosophy, killing of doctors by anti-abortionists, the issues of Padophilia among Catholic priests, the oppression of women by Taliban, are all examples of perversion and evil, not just pretend to but actually depend on certain philosophies upheld by a few even today.
How western secularism might have contributed to the explosion of homosexuality in the West? The answer is: the same way as it has in the explosion of Aids; through promiscuity. Declaring irresponsible sexual behavior (discrete sex with multiple partners) as personal is fundamentally wrong. Sexual behavior is social in every aspect of it, it involves more than one person and it affects more than one person. It can not be personal thus require social approval. Societies adhering to strict morality in observation of sexual behavior limit not only STDs, such as AIDS, but also protect the process of procreation. Lowest prevalence of AIDS among Muslim societies speaks for itself. It should not be surprising if there are minimal numbers of homosexuals there too.
Over the past centuries, as Islam spread far and wide all over the world, Muslims mingled their cultures with religion making it something different than what it actually was. So many things that were not permitted by religions by quietly practiced in many cultures became a part of MUSLIM culture and it seemed as if Islam allows it. One of such things is homosexuality.
Now for the point why tolerance has disappeared for un-Islamic practices now, over the past century Muslims have realized(as a result of modernization, globalization and several other factors) that their religion has turned in to something else with the amalgam of cultures. So, a major part of Muslim world is being converted to to practicing the core values of Islam as stated in Quran and sunnah (like in Saudi Arabia, Iran etc.)
According to the rules of the religion there is punishment for every crime. So the core Islam practicing nations are just following the rules of Islam. Plus Islam does not treat a boy attaining puberty a minor!
Keeping aside all my reservations about the author and her piece of intellectual crap, there is one thing I completely agree with her on; that history repeats itself. But unfortunately for her, it’s the other way round. Anyway, ill elaborate on it later on.
Being the radical fanatic Islamist I am, I believe that for every matter at hand, the source of guidance should come from Islam. However, since the author of the article is one of the “enlightened” Muslims, God forbid I use the Quran or Sunnah to express my viewpoint, lest I may be called a Talibani Mullah by the enlightened ones. After all, the author specifically stated that she is not interested in a theological debate about whether homosexuality is permissible or prohibited in Islam.
But funnily, although the author clearly stated that she is not interested in what Islam says about homosexuality, the theme of her article was about homosexuality in Muslim societies. It is absolutely absurd to say that one wants to discuss a phenomenon taking place in a Muslim society without discussing what Islam has to say about that particular phenomenon. After all, what makes a society “Muslim” is Islam. If the author was not interested in the Islamic viewpoint of homosexuality, then she should have changed the theme of her article to homosexuality in the Turkish or Arab or whatever society. However, that would have gone against the cleverly deceptive motives of the author. By using the term “Muslim Societies”, the author tries to justify a socially perverted phenomenon in such a way that an innocent reader might get the impression that homosexuality is actually permissible in Islam. These cleverly deceptive motives of the author are evident from the fact that she claims that the prohibition of homosexuality in Islam is disputed, and subject to debate.
Keeping up to her questionable intentions, the author of the article quotes instances from the times of the Ottomans and the Abbasids when homosexuality was not frowned upon. Contradicting herself on the issue of not wanting a theological debate on Islamic viewpoint of homosexuality, the author cites instances from the times of the Ottomans and the Abbasids when Sharia courts were lenient in dealing with homosexuals. Wait, doesnt stuff like Sharia and Qazi has something to do with Islam?
Contradicting herself once again, the author did actually touch the Islamic viewpoint of homosexuality. But surprisingly, to explain the Islamic viewpoint of homosexuality, she did not quote any prominent Muslim scholar. In fact, she did not quote any Muslim at all! She quoted Brian Whitaker from The Guardian. The very fact that the author had to quote a non-Muslim to explain what Islam has to say about homosexuality speaks volumes for itself. And more surprisingly, the article of Brian Whitaker which she quoted from has nothing of substance. In his article, Brian Whitaker keeps repeating that the Quran does not clearly condemn homosexuality, but the fellow did not provide a single evidence to back his claim. In fact, much like the self appointed “moderate Muslims”, he points out to instances of homosexuality in different Muslim societies rather than providing evidence from the Quran or Sunnah.
We the people in the land of pure have been living in the state of denial from realities. Homosexuality, rape, incest, adultery, pre-marital sex, affairs, prostitution and such practices are common in our society but no one want to admit or accept these practices in open. It is our cultural value that we do not accept what is deviation from normality the artificial yard stick that we have learned generation to generation.
So I guess the thumbs up for the writer is for discussing something “taboo”. A sizeable number on this blog have commented that they know that homosexuality is forbidden against by the Quran and Sunnah but they couldn’t care less. So I guess it is about whether you want to follow the teachings of Islam or not. My issue is don’t go on and argue senselessly how you are living a life in complete accordance with Islam and yet are practicing homosexuality as well. Just live with the fact that people who follow the teachings of Islam disagree with you and hence can not sanction same sex marriages in Pakistan the very constitution of which guarantees that no act againts the Quran and Sunnah will be enacted. The writer asserts that there is controversy in Islam about it: “with some Muslim groups condemning homosexual acts as a sin and others arguing that it is natural, and therefore created and condoned by the Almighty. This post simply considers how Muslim societies deal with homosexuality in practice”. All Ulemas of both the Sunni and Shia schools of thought will tell you how they consider it one of the greatest sins. I wonder who the writer is referring to. I think she gets her sense of right and wrong from “mufti” Brain Whitaker. To me drawing your sense of right and wrong on matters that religion has spokes so unequivocally from a person who does not follow Islam (Brian Whitaker)is only for people who do not want to follow the Quran. It’s her personal choice if she does not want to believe in this. The problem starts when she starts asserting that any one who disagrees with her is an extremist. Read “But in an age where regard for human rights should trump all, they deserve better than that. One can only hope that the current era of don’t-ask-don’t-tell tolerance evolves into something more progressive and open. Sadly, looking at present-day Pakistan as it abandons social tolerance for blind EXTREMISM, it seems as if history truly is fated to repeat itself) Ever heard of Pavlov’s dogs? Ring bell – dog salivates. The west accepts homosexuality … “intellectuals” in our society start dying to attend the first gay marriage!
A very well thought out and well written piece…
I think homosexuals should have as much right to express their sexuality as ant heterosexual in any society but in a society like Pakistan, i think gay rights are pretty low on the list of other human rights that get violated in our society on everyday basis. One positive step is the recent passage of domestic violence law which i was shocked to learn did not exist before, we need to address our blasphemy laws and hadood ordinance and noone ever talks about the condition of our jails and torture on innocent people when we are the most vocal about Gitmo…
The most important tool to fight bigotry is to talk! its quite encouraging to see Pakistani media covering this very important issue. My blog has long been covering homosexuality in this region.
http://sherryx.wordpress.com/category/gender-and-sexuality/
The absurdity of some posts that link indecency or inappropriate behavior to homosexuality.
Women are raped and degraded by heterosexuals, children are doled the same by heterosexuals in far majority over homosexuals. Let’s not claim any mantle of decency as heterosexuals, yeah?
I’m confident of my heterosexual status not to feel threatened by homosexuals.
As a Clinical Psychologist in training, I can confirm what Miss Yusuf says, people, even mental health experts for that matter, aren’t still sure whether homosexuality is a choice or something entirely biological i.e “hard-wired”.
There have been horrendous experiments involving electrically shocking otherwise ‘normal’ males each time they experienced arousal in response to pictures of near nude men.
the debate rages on…
However, cutting-edge research has brought to light so called ‘differences in brain structure’ between homosexual men heterosexual ones. some researchers have even theorized that the brains are shaped or respond to stimuli much in the same fashion as brains of females..
If somehow science does manage to ‘prove’ that homosexuality is hardwired, gay men and women have little to celebrate…
prejudices and biases are hard, if not impossible, to get rid of…
I believe the whole debate about legalizing homosexuality and the very manner in which such people are two separate issues…
I admit i am poorly schooled in matters that requiring knowledge of Islamic law, however, i am thoroughly surprised when i see so-called learned scholars and well-educated people react with alarming levels of homophobia.
The way i see things, the following may occur,
Science will prove that homosexuality is hardwired. the rift between science and religion will widen.
A debate will follow about whether it is, after all, a disease, Human rights activists will explode. Homosexuals will explode.
Others will want to “treat” it. they may try to genetically weed out the “gay gene” (of course human rights activists and homosexuals will-you got it-explode.
But let’s say it is weeded out.. what will happen to the endangered species of homosexuals who are alive at the time… will we then ban them from indulging….
Once more human rights activists and homosexuals will….
This article is really a bold one featuring the true picture of homosexuality.I think time has come to discuss the matter frankly to make our way out.We just can’t keep the matter as secret.Huma I thank you for your bold article.
Kudos for this article! It’s good to see Pakistani writers finally bringing the issue out of the closet. Gay and lesbian people exist everywhere. It’s upto the society whether they want to acept them or not.
I’m an Indian gay and have gay friends in pakistan who say that they’re too afraid to come out, and are not very hopeful of having gay pride celebrations in the near future. But I wish things change for the better.
As for Islam, I think it’s how we interpret the Quran. This applies to gay rights, women’s rights, minority rights, etc.
Good one, Huma. I am sure you must have thought twice before making up your mind and going ahead with it! Well, we adapt so many things that have no connection with our religions and cultures, on the technological front in particular. At an interaction with the media at Hyderabad Deccan about a year ago, a gay activist was urging the society to accept and mainstream the gay/lesbian population. One of the media persons turned around asked `when you go against the opinion of the majority, why should the majority listen to a miniscule population like yours?’. I guess that sums up the way people think about the gay/lesbian. When we hate or dislike certain things with a high degree of conviction, we obviously search and research for all that we can muster to substantiate our point of view than simply trying to undrestand the people who are begging to be heard. And, as long as it continues, the gay/lesbian keeps getting stronger albeit under the surface. We acknowledge it, it will help protect public health – keep condemning it, spend billions on HIV a little later.
I don’t think the argument here was whether the Qur’an permits homosexuality or not. I don’t understand why some people are so confused. It’s a stated FACT that the Qur’an does not permit homosexuality, taking the Surah Lut into context.
HOWEVER, this article that Huma Yosuf has wrote is highlighting more of the issue of why the Ummah went from using a proper legal process on the issue of Homosexuality to all of a sudden killing homosexuals in the dawn of the 19th century. Why the sudden shift?
In other words, why did our tolerance level shrink all of a sudden?
The question that is of focus here is more of the history of homosexuality in the ummah and how our opinions have shifted from the past to the present. So no one is arguing the legality of homosexuality in the context of the Quran.
The question here is more of why the sudden shift in the mood of thinking in muslim legal systems?
The question that immediately comes to mind after reading this article is: How and why did the Ummah become so intolerant and started playing the role of Supreme Decision makers in our legal system?
I believe the writer has mustered up courage to discuss a religious taboo. And most of her arguments seem to have solid grounds.
Huma Yusuf, this is an excellent and insightful feature!
Best regards from London, England
Ali Sultan
WOW!…did not think I would even see this article in Pakistani newspaper…Right or wrong , its time we discuss opinions and not be judging people on hearsay…As for Quom – e- loot, there is difference on people who just like to pleasure on young boys or males and the western type of homosexuality in which same sex people are attracted to each other at any age. Not everyones cup of tea , but necessary to mention the difference.
Interesting article. The way I see it, our (Pakistani) society looks down upon celebrating any kind of sexuality so what’s so odd if gays cannot celebrate their sexuality. In our society, we do not accept/tolerate public display of affection (something as innocent as holding hands) even among married couples so it is beyond me as to what kind of rights Huma is seeking for gays. Having said that, just like anyone else in this society, gays can also enjoy whatever they wish to, behind closed doors.
Regardless of what society one is in, whether you are a gay or any other minority, unless you fight for your own rights, no one else is going to give you your rights in a platter. Unless you are proud of who you are or what you stand for, no one else is going to make you feel proud of your identity. The same has been proven by African Americans and women, in the past.
Nearly half a century ago, Indiana University’s Kinsey Institute published a report (book) titled, THE SIXTH MAN. One out of 6 men in America experienced a homosexual act at least once in their lifetime.
People who have lived in S. Arabia have told me that homosexuality is common in that country, although homosexuals there are still in the closet. Powerful elites marry so many women there, that there is a shortage of women. It is extremely expensive to get married in S.Arabia.
ARK writes: “I view homosexuality as the new manifestation of the modern western secular society….”
—–
Speaking from my own experience, I hardly think that the Saudi taxi driver who placed his hand high up on my thigh en route from the Jeddah airport to my hotel was either Western or secular. When I immediately removed his hand, he threatened in broken English to take me into the desert and abandon me; however, I made a counter threat that convinced him to drop me at the hotel. This was not unrequited Western secularism. Don’t give me that holier-than-thou stuff; perversion and evil don’t depend on philosophies or mythologies, though they may pretend to.
Well written and well argued! From my understaning I would believe that there is no doubt that same sex interactions are sinful and not allowed in Islam. Also, not just exploitative (as Huma refers to) but consensual acts are equally unacceptable and sinful. However, while saying this we should bear in mind that hetro-sexual behavior outside of marriage is also equally sinful and not allowed in Islam.
So is it sexual pereference or practice thats the casue of concern? I would think this is an area of debate…
Having said that, denial of human rights, discrimination, social and economic ostracism on the basis of one’s sexual preference or sexual identity is totally unacceptable and all socities must strive to eradicate it, e.g. India in the very recent past.
Two points:
1) The entire Pakistan let alone the whole world is NOT Muslim.
2) Can any Muslim on the face of this earth claim he/she hasnt committed any sin ever? If its on the Almighty to make the final decision after all, then lets us all try n make ourselves better humans than pointing fingers and judging people’s moralities.
Peace
Great article!!
It is foolish to argue that homosexuality did not exist in Muslim societies. It has existed and does exist in each and every corner of the planet though to varying extents.
Homosexuality is natural because it exists naturally. The question why homosexuals cant reproduce is silly because sex is not just for reproduction but it is one of the basic physiological needs. Most of the times we do sex for relieving sexual tensions, for sexual pleasure and rarely to impregnate a woman. Though Gays and lesbians can’t reproduce bisexuals can. Would you please accept bisexuals?? Answer is most likely no!!
I think sexuality should be left to the subject’s taste like types of food a person likes. If a society does not accept homosexuality surely it is going to frustrate itself affecting its own efficiency because gays and bisexuals are people with all other qualities similar to straights except different sexual orientation. Out come would be worse than those societies that accept it. I personally don’t believe in a God who created me a gay just to frustrate my life in the world of straights.
ANSWER THIS: So your child is gravely ill and needs to go see a doctor or is hospitilized. Say he needs a specialist present that day and the doctor attending to him is gay.
do you let you child die?
IF NO… then how do reconcile the fact, that the man who gave life to your kid, is a man or women you would like to make his life misearble and treat him like a dog or won’t care if he was killed by hate mongers?
get over you gay phobia- what they do in the bedroom is not going to make your ability to earn a living and live happily.
I am sure that Islamic societies are not struggling w.r.t to homosexuality. We are pretty much clear about that.
where minorities are being burned alive for religious intolerence i think more pressing issues are at hand
we need to focus are energies somewhere else , once we are on the right track we can bring out all the hush hush issues out from under the carpet
a country where its getting hard to live for common people other things need priority !!!!
From the above comments it is clear how easy it is to enter into the is-it-Islamic-or-not discourse. But that was clearly not the subject of the article. Fortunately no one is questioning the existence of homosexuality in our society.
While living in London I closely observe the Gay Pride event of the last few years, especially this year. It was widely criticized by the intelligentsia in Britain for missing the point. This, if you don’t know already, is the 40th year of the gay rights movement started in USA in 1969 after the Stonewall Riots.
However the Gay Pride, London, and other Prides in Europe have been reduced to nothing more than pointless conglomeration of astray youth whose sole purpose for gathering is pleasure and partying. Their official slogan in London was “come out and play”.
This senseless ostentatious display hardly follows on the spirit of Stonewall Riots. You ask for gay pride in Pakistan, I say ask for a rally that demands equal treatment by the law in the work place and private regardless of race, sex or orientation. Now that is a rally worth going to.
To my second point, Pakistan’s don’t-ask-don’t-tell has cultural overtones that are not necessarily wrong. It is what makes it peculiar to our culture. We have, and thanks by and large to, Begam Nawazish, brought transsexualism to popular discourse, not enough if you ask me. Cross dressing is less of a stigma than it was 10-15 years ago. Homosexuality will too. The last thing one needs is this movement to be tainted by western influence, which bares no comparison whatsoever at this stage. It is our own movement and we should like it this way one step at a time.
Sensitive subject but dealt with fairly and thoughtfully. I admire your courage for writing on this subject at a time when no one in Pakistan seems to look at any thing beyond the realm of religion. Homosexuality is a reality most people don’t like to accept all over the world. Keep writing. Shafiq
Thanks Huma for bringing this taboo subect in public domain. I am surprised that in Pakistan, bold articles like this one is being published. We do have a future.
Living outside Pakistan I have friends who are openly happy. However, this does not mean that I condone their actions.
The example of Pakhtoons is used in bad taste, as sex with unaged boys should not be considered any thing other than sexual perversion. Such people are not just jailed, but their behavour is monitored for decades and names are published to warn neighbours in the USA.
I feel such articles could encourage “abnormal” behaviour as apposed to freedom for gays.
If the writer wants to see men kissing in the streets, it should be noted that such freedom is not even enjoyed by straight couples in Pakistan.
When it comes to “real” gay folk, they are free to live together in Pakistan, as there is no law that forbids men from living together.
It is difficult to see what change the writer really wants in society.
The writer has done tremendous service to Muslim community
for her very thought provoking initiation of debate on this closet issue
which deserves to be discussed in schools, media and mosques.
It should be noted that the Quran is NOT silent on homosexuality, it is explicitly forbidden in the story of Lut, as pointed out by others in comments.
The real question is: are muslims willing to question the content of the Quran? Given that the Quran references itself and declares itself to be a perfect book, there is little room for argument.
congratulations to Huma and Dawn for dealing with a ‘no-no’ topic in Pakistan. There is a plethora of scientific evidence which show that one’s sexual orientation is ‘a given’ rather than one’s free choice. May i plead understanding, compassion, and tolerance toward all: heterosexuals, gays, lesbians, transvestites (hijras), and others. They are all human beings. Please remember: baa khabar sho az muqam-e adamee. aadmiyat ahteram-e aadami. (Muhammad Iqbal)
I dont agree with Huma because her subject do not reflect Islam.
The “art” shown here is disgusting to me. For a short period, I went store to store to sell electrical plugs in Karachi when I was about 15. During that time, I encountered few low lives, who wanted to make me their “Wine Boy”. I was smarter and could tell the difference between nice affectionate people and these “Shah Abbass”.
Nature provides various tools to every specie to survive for a certain period of time and reproduce. Occasionally, there are species born with deformities (including sexual deformities). Humans lack the instincts that other animals have and therefore must rely very heavily on learned lessons. People born with any form of deformities should be treated with respect and their needs should be respected by the society.
The main sexual attraction is driven by nature’s law of reproduction. All other deviant sexual attractions are results of learned behaviors and the combinations of complex psychological interactions.
Evidently, homosexuality gives pleasure to some but so does other things which cause severe harm to the individuals and/or the society. Until recently, the acceptable and non acceptable behaviors in a society was mostly dependent on the preferences of its rulers. Akber’s India was significantly different that of Aurangzeb’s. Every society has tolerated homosexuality for a certain period of time and when things get out of control and the harm to the society exceeds a certain threshold, the same ‘liberal” society becomes ‘conservative’ .
Young boys need affection, and look upon certain adults as role models and seek guidance from them. Unfortunately, when some young boys encounter people like “Shah Abbas” their lives are ruined. With hormone levels jumping rampantly in young boys, some fall for this and many have psychological scars for the rest of their lives. To me, this is criminal and should be punished severely as this is not consensual, but rather child molestation. What adults want to do behind closed door should be their own business in theory, but in reality, many homosexuals prey on young boys.
I came to USA when I turned 17 and have done many odd jobs including waiting tables and taxi driving. I had to be very careful and firm as many closet gays wanted me to become their “Robin”. I have met many openly gays and lesbians and I really feel sorry for them. They are mostly confused, rejected by society, love starved, violent, jealous and suicidal. Yes, I am homophobic and would advise every parent to keep a very close eye on their children to make sure that homosexuals do not destroy their lives. For the parents of unfortunate children, who are born with sexual deformities, they should be brave and not let the pressure from the society force them to abandon their children. Society should have programs to address the special needs of these people. Don’t let the rainbow flags flying high in Western countries fool you. I am confident that they will eventually realize the damage. We do not have to copy everything West does.
Bold, very bold! You’ve got chutzpah lady. I applaud your effort. I will be honest with you though it’s kind of bizarre to hear of Pakistani’s actually discussing this very taboo subject. But then In the schizophrenic Pakistani society where people are burnt alive on the pretext of pseudo religious injunctions like the hudood (in)ordinance and blasphemy discussing the “history of homosexuality” then makes for good (non) sense.
Homosexuality extols a heavy price psychologically, and I know that from my personal experience. Being born a Muslim and raised in Pakistan it was difficult for me to accept it as an integral part of me after I realized that I have no interest in girls but boys. But then I came to Europe for studies and thereby the fear reduced, thus began the real fighting in me which may have played a role in making me religious in the beginning. Until I realized, thankfully in only a few months, how futile the whole exercise is, I started reconciling my thoughts with my sexuality. I questioned the core religious beliefs, which we are indoctrinated from our childhoods and became more unreligious in my outlook. Certainly, when the thought of a male class fellow sparked butterflies flying in my body and I know that I don’t feel sexually excited by girls, (any… even the naked ones) and that the religious dogmas don’t recognize that fact, something is wrong with them. These many years were quite painful and caused depression, illness, reduced self-confidence, to name a few. But now after my coming out here and working with different LGBT organizations, I am much better off and comfortable with my sexuality. I wish more tolerance and respect for diversity finds its way over there and hope that the current grim situation has something good stored in it for Gays and Lesbians along with others.
Dear madam,
You have not discussed the medical aspect.
it would have been great if Huma had quoted some reference from the Past on her claim it was rampant or legal to be involved in Homosexuality in the Abbasid or some other Muslim era.
Absolutely this is the start what author is preaching rights for homosexuals and next suchwriters will be asking rights for those who produce love child or child without father.
Qur’an is not silent about gays as commented by one of the blogger. In fact Qur’an is very critical about such un natural acts of the gays. The real story of the people of Prophet Loath (AS) who were mostly gays and the dire punishment Allah (SWT) meted out to those peoples is to my mind a firm testimony of the dis-pleasure of the Creator towards this way of satisfying one’s desires.
I have lived in UK since my teens and visited Pakistan fairly regularly.I am fairly regular peson of 65.
I am very impressed by the thought process of the writer of this article!
As long as there are people like her in that society, there is hope! Keep up the good work & debate.
Muslim societies treat homosexuals as they do all minorities – at best they are barely tolerated, and worst they are persecuted. They are never accepted.
How unfortunate it is that in today’s world every tom, dick and Harry try to give verdict and interpret Islam from their own point of view!! I reckon that they try to please their own whims and fantisies.
The examples which the writer has given from the Caliphate era does not legitimate or legalize homosexuality rather it manifest such a judicial system of Islam which was based upon truth, where decisions were made on solid and definite evidence, unlike today’s Judicial system of Western democracy.
The Fundamental question of Existence is Survival, Growth, and Evolution.
Religions are socio-economic strategies that best answer to the Fundamental Question with tried and tested strategies. The Islam of Moses was the ideal system for Pastoral era, the Islam of Jesus for the Agrarian times, and Islam of Mohammed (AS) for the Trading age (of Mecca then, of globe today). Moses was a shepherd, Jesus an artisan in the Fertile Crescent, Mohammed a trader.
Homosexuality is meant to limit production (human) and is a natural response to a society that is unable or unwilling to grow. Homosexuality is tolerated only in the last stage of a civilizational cycle – Athens, Abbaside/Ottoman/Mughal Empires when they stop growing and evolving and turn to survival. The Corporate West stopped growing by end of 19th century and has been in “Survival” stage since mid-Victorian times. In fact it is in “Suicidal” stage as Iqbal (1906)put it well before Europe eliminated 120,000,000 of its own in 31 years (1914-45) or roughly 1 in 4 just to survive. No country in Europe save France can feed itself with borders closed. Europe, like Athens before, is hopelessly over-populated, and thus homo-tolerant.
Islam today is in its second civilizational cycle; the conditions today globally are exactly the same as in Mecca in Mohammedan times – small business against big business (Omayyads), Bankers (banu Abbas), infidels, and Judahists. The Corporate West fears that Islam using Mohammedan tactics will do an Encore. It will.
Islam worldwide is in ascendency since at least 100 years – Growth and Evolution. Homosexuality will become tolerated again in Islam when it stops growing (if at all) and becomes moribund. Aspirant Muslim Homophiles have to wait at least a few hundred years, i.e. if they believe in second decline of Islam. I doubt that Islam will repeat its past mistakes. So Muslim Homophiles, lose hope for ever. Then who says you can not leave Islam and join those who are in decline anyway. It is your choice.
Prevalent of homosexuality in the Muslim world is also contributed by cultural separation of the mingling of the opposite sexes. Particularly in Pakistan and other conservative Muslim societies such as Iran, Saudi Arabia.
My knowledge of Quran is based on hear say.I believe their is some discouraging reference in it relating to Prophet Noah.
Pakistan should endeavor to liberalise social mingling of sexes. It will reduce emotional sexual starvation that hinders social progress.